#189 – Healthy eating for kids | Austin McGuffie & Ben Grynol

How do parents manage their kids’ food choices when they’re surrounded by candy, chips, and fast food? And even more so, how do parents maintain the balance of healthy attitudes around eating while still guiding their kids to make healthier choices? Austin McGuffie and Ben Grynol chat about the challenges of kid nutrition, healthy but delicious recipes for kids, cultivating an educated relationship with food in your children, ways to make exercise more enjoyable, and more.

02:11 – Help kids make better food choices and lead by example

Austin McGuffie teaches his kids to see food as a tool that can help make or break their day. By explaining the possible ramifications of their food choices, he trains his children to make better decisions in terms of health and nutrition.

I think probably the best thing that we [can] do is to be good examples, right? Like my wife and I, we both work out or try our best to work out. We eat real food, good food for ourselves. And so naturally, when they come into the kitchen and they want to feed themselves, they have access to the same food that we have access to. And that’s food that we eat to nourish our bodies. There’s not too much junk that we have in the home that they have access to, because truth be told, when they’re not at home, they kind of do what they want, man. Like I wish that I could brag and say, ‘Oh, well, you know, we teach our kids to eat protein before carbs and fat.’ When we eat [and] cook breakfast with them, sure. If I’m standing over them, I’m like, ‘Hey, you know, eat those eggs first.’ But then when they’re out at school and we’re there monitoring, just, you know, they’re visiting and they’re walking around with a Nutri-Grain bar, I know for a fact they didn’t have any protein before eating that. It’s just like, ‘Oh, well, it is what it is. I try my best.’ And they’re kids. Kids are gonna be kids.

We don’t tell them that food is either healthy or unhealthy, to be honest with you. We kind of tell them that food is a tool that can take you where you want to go. And so I kind of paint a picture like, ‘You have a toolbox, and depending on how you want to feel and the type of day you want to have, that’s how you should choose the food that you want to eat.’ So while candy is, by most people’s standards unhealthy, explain that to the kids. It’s like, I can say that it’s unhealthy, but it doesn’t click. What clicks for them is, ‘Hey, if you eat this candy, you’re gonna feel bad.’ And [even] then, feeling bad doesn’t click either. Honestly, it’s, ‘You’re gonna feel bad, and then you’re gonna be in a bad mood, and then you’re gonna be sleepy, and then you’re gonna be cranky and then, you’re gonna be arguing with your sisters.’ And then when we start explaining the ramifications of the food, that’s what clicks to them. It’s not so much where the food is healthy or unhealthy, it’s what is the outcome of eating these foods, and then kind of leaving it up to them to make educated decisions from there.

07:43 – Know when to give in to a kid’s wants and when to firmly say no

One of the toughest challenges parents face when keeping their kids on a healthy diet is saying no when they ask for candy or junk food, just as kids do. Ben and Austin talk about how they strike the balance between conceding to a child’s requests and firmly saying no.

I think that’s what’s so tough about taking care of kids. Taking care of them [is] number one, but then feeding them well [is] number two. Ben, you and I are busy, too. We’re still trying to handle all the things that we have going on, and it’s really hard to slow down to prioritize and make conscious decisions about what we’re putting in their bodies. I mean, I have moments where I cave, but I think that you have to give yourself grace for that, if the other 80% of the time when you’re not caving, you’re feeding your kids good food. I think that the human species [are] naturally risk-takers to some degree. I was listening to a podcast of Dr. Casey and Dr. Perlmutter talking about uric acid and he was saying that primitively, humans become more [of] risk-takers when we’re seeking food [to nourish] our bodies. And I think that a lot of us as parents especially, we’re like, ‘how much junk can my kids have without jeopardizing their health?’ That’s like a balance. It’s tough because if I give my kid a Snickers, right? What are the chances that he’s going to accumulate a bunch of fructose in his liver and have fatty liver from one Snicker a week? Chances are not very likely, right? So that makes that decision a little bit easier for me. So it’s a constant [battle of] what can I get away with my kids while still making sure that they’re healthy, and that looks different for everybody.

13:51 – Allow your kids to experience the consequences of their food choices

Ben and Austin both give examples of scenarios when their kids had to deal with the negative effects of excess of certain foods like candy. Austin asserts that it’s important to give your kids the room to make choices and deal with the consequences firsthand, as it helps them understand your advice better.

Our two girls, Penelope and Zoe, really wanted to have ice cream. And it was a little bit later [in the day], not 10:00 PM late, but it was maybe, whatever, 6:37. So they might have had the ice cream around then. They go to bed shortly after. And they just both wake up [from night] terrors cause they probably had terrible sleep, right? And they just had like a pile of sugar before bed. And these are things that, you’re pushing back against it saying, ‘No, you can’t have this. Here’s why.’ […] So then you feel [that] you’re caught in between these two worlds and it’s just a very real parenting thing.

For Halloween, we took the approach [of], ‘Let’s moderate their candy intake.’ […] What we did was we went to each of their rooms and we said, ‘Hey, pick your favorite ten pieces of candy, and I want you to put that away in a secret place, and I’m gonna let you moderate throughout the week. I’m gonna suggest having one piece of candy a week, but lemme see how you do on your own.’ Two of the kids, my girls Cadence and Caelyn, smashed it. Actually, Cadence still has some more. But they both didn’t moderate how we taught them to, which is fine. They’re five and seven years old. But they both ended up getting sick just a couple [of] days later. Our seven-year-old who’s very perceptive had stomach aches. Her mood was just completely off for a few days and it was a really good opportunity for Fantasia and [me] to sit down with them and be like, ‘Look, this is why we say no.’ And so I think kids are very smart. I think if we actually sit down and explain the no to them, even though they fight us on it, they understand and I’m okay with that. That’s a victory for me. […] So I think allowing the room for your kids to experience that is important. It’s just like adults experiencing failure. Like how are we gonna learn and grow if we’re not constantly trying and failing things? And I look at kids’ nutrition the same way. If you’re not eating poor food and, and understanding the ramifications of it, then you’re not gonna understand why I say no.

20:43 – Make exercise enjoyable by leaning into your kid’s interests

Exercise is just as important as nutrition for a growing child. Sit down with your kid and figure out the interests that they genuinely enjoy—whether that’s ballet, soccer, cheer dancing, or even parkour—to make exercise a fun and sustainable activity for them.

Once you start leaning into what they’re interested in, then it becomes less of a forcing function where they’re like, ‘Oh, I don’t want to do that thing.’ If a kid doesn’t wanna play football, the kid doesn’t wanna go on their bike, like, that’s not of interest. [It’s about] finding the other things, and I say it because our eldest is eight and he’s super into dancing. He loves dancing, he loves ballet, he loves all these things. And he practices [and] sort of taught himself by watching The Wiggles. And he watches all these videos, but that’s physical. We talked to him about how great that physical movement is for his body and he’ll do it for hours. But he’s not super interested in going outside to play soccer or something. It’s just not of interest. And so leaning into those things and saying, ‘It’s totally cool to do that now.’ The caveat is balancing the whole idea of screen time with doing something that’s physically active, there’s screen time involved. Whole different conversation, but it’s important to be outside, it’s more important to be moving, period. To be doing things that are good for your body as opposed to just being sedentary.

How can we get everybody to be active and keep their morale high? And the answer was to spend time with them individually to figure out what type of movement works for them. So now, instead of everybody doing the same thing, I’ve got some kids over here doing some resistance training because they enjoy it. I’ve got kids over here doing dancing, some over here doing cheer. I’ve got a few over here doing parkour and it’s all accomplishing the same goal. It just looks different for everybody. So like you said, man, very important. Leaning into a type of activity that encourages them to just move their body, whatever it is.

27:15 – Understand that your kid is an individual with their own tastes and preferences

Make nutritious food more palatable to your kid by catering to their tastes. A child might like one vegetable and dislike another, and it doesn’t necessarily mean that they like or dislike all other vegetables. Figuring out what your kids like helps you understand them better and make better meals while still optimizing for maximum nutrition.

What works for two of my kids, while two of them might adapt well to this dietary philosophy that my wife and I have established in our home, maybe the other two don’t. It’s not their fault really. They just were born with different taste buds, different preferences, and it’s our job as parents to figure out how to create a dietary lifestyle for them that they can adhere to and stick to outside of our influence. And I think that’s where a lot of us are failing, and it’s where I failed. So there’s no judgment to anybody else out there. I start with me. I can see that within myself, where my oldest, luckily he assimilated just fine, but our seven-year-old, like I said, she’s yelling at me talking about what she doesn’t want. And for years I was like, ‘Bro, you’ve gotta be tripping, talking to me like that. You’re gonna eat this food.’ And she rebelled, didn’t eat it, [and it] caused a lot of stress. I didn’t even think at the time how much stress this was causing her because [she was] yelling, [and] getting frustrated before eating, which is not good. And all I had to do was take a little bit of time, ask some questions, understand what she prefers, and then help her identify how she should be eating for optimal health.

28:57 – Strike a balance between a nutritious diet and a healthy relationship with food

Laying the foundation for an educated perspective on food and a healthy relationship with it is a tightrope that parents have to walk through. For Ben and Austin, the keys are balance and compromise. When kids start to blindly refuse certain foods, it can show an unhealthy relationship with food. The reasoning behind decisions should come from understanding the real consequences that come along with consuming certain foods.

Balance, maybe that’s the word, balance. Kids that sort of have this foundation for physical activity, health, and wellness, and understand this at a very basic level so that it doesn’t feel like, you never want the kid to be like, ‘Well, I don’t eat the croissants cause my dad says no.’ You don’t want that. Because then they’ve got this unhealthy relationship with food in general. No, [there’s a] time and a place [that] you’re gonna do it. Just understand what’s gonna happen. Doesn’t mean it’s an all-the-time thing. It might be a, sometimes it’s like a treat thing. We’re not doing cupcakes every day. We’re not doing whatever it is every day. But now, and again, we’re gonna live a balanced life until we raise kids across the gamut of education and physical activity and food, just general health and wellness.

32:01 – Encourage kids to take ownership of their food

Help your kids take ownership of their food choices by involving them in the cooking process and positively reinforcing the work they’ve contributed. This would help them not only trust their capabilities and intelligence but also make them more likely to eat healthy food because they had a hand in the preparation and cooking process.

On the back end, kids [don’t have] the neural pathways connected to truly understand the impact of eating certain foods [yet]. They’re just not capable of understanding. So you gotta get on their level and give ’em something that they can understand. Like, ‘Hey, even if you don’t understand why you should be eating broccoli, if you just make this, if you get involved in the process,’—we do this with the kids at the school. Some of [the] vehemently oppose vegetables. Like ‘I don’t need vegetables,’ But we’ll come with some spinach and some celery and a whole bunch of other stuff, and everybody puts gloves on and it’s like, ‘We’re just gonna juice this. Okay, we’re gonna make some juice. We’ve got some apples and some ginger to, you know, spice it up a little bit.’ But they get involved in making it and they drink it. They don’t always like it, but they’ll at least try it and expose themselves to it because they were involved in the process. So absolutely, man. Get these kids in the kitchen and let them create stuff.

37:38 – Make food taste palatable and enjoyable

Be creative with your food. Experiment and hack your way into serving highly nutritious meals and snacks to kids by making them delicious and palatable for young tastebuds and their specific cravings.

She’s eating this food, and she’s like, ‘It just doesn’t taste good.’ And I’m thinking that [she doesn’t] like vegetables. But no, it really doesn’t taste good, like, cook good food, do your best to make your food taste good. That’s something that I never really [thought about], I don’t know. I’m a whole grown man and I didn’t know how to make broccoli taste good. I grew up eating steamed broccoli. That’s what my parents made for us, and that’s the only way I knew to make it. And so I was putting a boiling pot of water and steaming broccoli over it, and then putting a little bit of salt on and saying, here, but then it’s all chewy and it’s not easy. It’s not, you know what I’m saying? It just wasn’t palatable for them. Earlier on, I was like, ‘Oh, my kids don’t like broccoli.’ [Then] I was like, ‘No, bro, you just suck at cooking.’ Like, you know, throw some olive oil on it, some salt and pepper, some garlic powder, and throw it in the oven and roast it instead. And then it tastes completely different. Same nutrients, maybe not as bioavailable since we cooked it, you know, whatever. But it exposes them to broccoli and it’s like, it’s not that they don’t like broccoli, it’s just that my dad sucked at cooking.

Chips are this thing that kids might want. I don’t know if they actually want the potato chip though. What they want is something crunchy and salty and small that they put in their mouth. So you turn that into kale chips with parmesan on top of it, or brussels sprouts, [and] peel the leaves. [A] little salt, little olive oil. You make those into chips pretty quickly. In their eyes, they’re still chips. They’re still getting the crunch and the salt, and it’s a lot different than just crushing deep-fried potatoes.

Instead of the kids eating candy, they’ll come [into] the kitchen on their own. They’ll cut up an apple, they’ll throw it in a skillet. And we have a small jar of maple syrup and I let them use it. Like, ‘Hey, just throw some maple syrup on some apples and some cinnamon,’ and they’ll have that instead of going to find a pack of Skittles or something like that. So finding nutritious ways for your kids to have that same psychological effect like you want something sweet, you want something salty, you want something crunchy, that’s fine. I’m just gonna take five extra minutes to think about how to give that to you without compromising your health.

41:14 – Keep trying every day

In a world that runs on convenient goods and fast food, parents need to accept that they can’t always stick to the most nutritious options for their kids. Ben and Austin emphasize that it’s important to follow best practices (like sequencing foods) and just keep trying every day.

It’s not a battle that you can win with all of them, but with some of them. Sequencing. One of the kids is too young to do anything, cause he’s one. But the other ones, [the order is] 1, 3, 6, 8. So the three-year-old and the eight-year-old really like salad. And so you sequence it, here you go, here’s your Caesar salad. You make it fresh. It’s good to go. Or some other type of salad. And they’ll eat that before they eat the pizza. And they’re not crushing nine slices of pizza. They might have two slices of pizza and they’ll enjoy it. And so not creating fear around that. Sometimes we make it at home, that’s if we pick up or something like that. But if we make it at home, then we’ll make it on these flatbreads that [have] basically zero net carbs cause they’re full of fiber and they’re pretty thin and stuff. They eat that and they don’t really know. You just have to sort of hack your way into it. And so that is a lot different than doing the, ‘Here’s the Domino’s,’ over and over. Don’t get me wrong. We do the Domino’s from time to time because they’re kids because that’s what they want. I’m not saying that I’m a huge fan of doing it, but it’s a matter of balancing it and it’s like, if you’re gonna have this, then we’re gonna have salad or whatever it is with it and work your way towards. I think that’s kind of the key—working the way toward it. ‘Cause it’s not like, one and done. You can’t win every meal. You can’t, but you can over time create the foundation so they’re opting into their own choices, they make the choices themselves whether or not they want to eat that.

Last night, for example, we’re at the hospital, three-year-old [had] a gash on his head, and we didn’t eat dinner. It’s like, ‘Bro, there’s an Arby’s right across the street,’ and it’s like, what do we do? Am I gonna wait and starve my kids until we get home because I wanna avoid this fast food option? No, I’m not gonna do that, man. So we’re gonna eat these processed roast beef mini-sandwiches, and you guys are gonna be fed and we’re gonna wake up in the morning and we’re gonna try again tomorrow. And that’s just the environment that we live in. So it’s hard to exist [and] not conform to the ways of the world, which is like a twist on the spiritual concept, but for nutrition. And that’s something that we all have to task ourselves to do, is to exist in the world, which is pursuing balance, but not succumbing to the ways of the world where we’re constantly exposing ourselves to these things all the time and ushering our kids to a life of all the things that come with poor nutrition.

Austin McGuffie (00:06):

She had each of our kids in the kitchen with her from the moment they were two, three years old. And every single time our kids come in the kitchen and make something for themselves, they love it. It could be the most disgusting stuff. Our nine year old has come in the kitchen and he makes these concoctions of just things you wouldn’t imagine, things you wouldn’t try. It’s like, “Hey dad, you want to try this?” And I’m like, “Dude, that looks disgusting. No.” But he’s devouring it, not because it actually tastes good, but because there’s a sense of ownership in what he created.

(00:37):

So, I think probably the number one thing I would say is give your kids ownership. Write it on a piece of paper, “Carter, you’re in charge of the carrots. Cadence, you’re in charge of the rice.” Or whatever the case is. I’ll tear it up man.

Ben Grynol (00:58):

I’m Ben Grynol, part of the early startup team here at Levels. We’re building tech that helps people to understand their metabolic health. And this is your front row seat to everything we do. This is a whole new level.

(01:24):

One of the hardest things as a parent is being a parent. That is a very true statement. But when it comes to things like health and wellness, when it comes to education, creating a foundation for kids to grow up and to really be aware of why physical activity is important, why eating well is important and what exactly are the differences between healthy foods and maybe foods that should be avoided, those being things that have a ton of sugar in them, or things that are highly processed, well this can become an uphill battle as a parent.

(01:55):

Sometimes it feels like you’re losing, it almost feels that every day, especially with young kids. And so Austin McGuffie, the Metabolism Mentor, whom many regular listeners are probably familiar with by now, he and I sat down and we discussed this idea of parenting. What do we share? Well, we’re both into metabolic health and we both have four kids, so we see the challenges firsthand on a day to day basis. It’s not always easy to build this foundation of food at a young age, but it’s one of those things that you keep going with and going with until it sticks. Anyway, it was a really fun conversation to dig in and riff on the idea of being a parent and raising kids. Here’s where we kick things off.

(02:42):

What are the biggest things that you do with your kids to build a healthy, just call it a healthy foundation around health, exercise, wellness, this whole idea? Without pontificating, without pushing it on them.

Austin McGuffie (02:57):

Right, honestly, it’s funny because I’ve done podcasts in the past where I have all the answers and then all the answers that I gave don’t work for me anymore, like with what I’m doing with my kids because they’re changing and their needs are changing. I think probably the best thing that we do is just to be good examples. My wife and I, we both work out or try our best to work out, and we eat real food, good food for ourselves. And so naturally when they come into the kitchen and they want to feed themselves, they have access to the same food that we have access to and that’s food that we eat to nourish our bodies. There’s not too much junk that we have in the home that they have access to, because truth be told, when they’re not at home they do what they want man.

(03:44):

I wish that I could brag and say, “Oh well we teach our kids to eat protein before carbs and fat.” And when we eat cook breakfast with them. Sure. If I’m standing over them I’m like, “Hey, eat those eggs first.” But then when they’re out at school and where they monitoring, just they’re visiting, and they’re walking around with a Nutrigrain bar, I know for a fact they didn’t have any protein before eating that. And it’s just like, “Oh well it is what it is. I tried my best.” And they’re kids, kids are going to be kids.

Ben Grynol (04:18):

Do you talk to them about what’s healthy and what’s not healthy?

Austin McGuffie (04:22):

Yeah.

Ben Grynol (04:23):

It’s weird though, because it’s you don’t want to put these insecurities in their mind of fear. Like, “Oh, you can’t have that, you can never have that.” They’re kids, they’re sponges that are trying to understand the world as it is. But how do you do that as far as creating that foundation around what’s healthy and what’s not healthy? Because they’re kids.

Austin McGuffie (04:50):

Well, we actually don’t tell them that food is either healthy or unhealthy to be honest with you. We tell them that food is a tool that can take you where you want to go. And so I paint a picture, you have a toolbox and depending on how you want to feel and the type of day you want to have, that’s how you should choose the food that you want to eat. So while candy is by most people’s standards unhealthy, explaining that to the kids, it’s like I can say that it’s unhealthy but it doesn’t click. What clicks for them is, “Hey, if you eat this candy, you’re going to feel bad.” And them feeling bad doesn’t click either. Honestly, you’re going to feel bad and then you’re going to be in a bad mood and then you’re going to be sleepy and then you’re going to be cranky, and then you’re going to be arguing with your sisters.

(05:39):

And then when we start explaining the ramifications of the food, that’s what clicks to them, it’s not so much whether food is healthy or unhealthy, it’s what is the outcome of eating these foods? And then leaving it up to them to make educated decisions from there.

Ben Grynol (05:56):

What have you done when… There’s always this scenario of a kid’s going to sit down and eat, let’s say some kind of meat, Brussel sprouts, you’re having a pretty healthy whole foods meal. And let’s assume it’s easier when they’re younger and they eat everything, but as they mature and they’re influenced by media, for sure, or just Billy around the block, their friend that, well Billy eats this all the time, Billy eats Bear Paws or whatever junk, right? Lucky Charms. How do you pull back from that? Because they start to get influenced and then it becomes harder where they put up the no, even though you can talk about the toolbox. What have you done in those situations?

Austin McGuffie (06:36):

I don’t want to say I forced them to eat the healthier food, but I don’t know, I guess I do what’s called leveraging. If my kids want to watch a movie or play a game or go outside, it’s like, “Great, I’m happy that you want to do those things. If you really want to do it, then this is my condition.” And sometimes I don’t always feel good about doing that, because I don’t want them to feel like they have to meet a performance metric or meet my standard in order to do the things that they want to do, but at the same time they’re kids and this is a very important time of their lives as far as the building blocks of their bodies and the things that we’re putting in them. So sometimes it’s like, “Hey, you’re not going to watch this movie until you eat those Brussel sprouts.” Or with my three year old, I’m in his face, I’m like, “All right, we got four Brussel sprouts left. I’m going to cut it in half, we’re going to eat half at a time.” And I’m eating it with him. So yeah, it really just depends on the kid, depends on the circumstance and depends on what carrot I can hold over their head.

Ben Grynol (07:44):

Do you go shopping with the kids?

Austin McGuffie (07:48):

When I have the patience. If I have the patience, I’ll take them with me. But to be honest with you, most of the time my wife and I, we do the shopping on our own. I think that mean you can relate, we have four kids and we both work from home and we’re with them all the time. Grocery trips are a moment for us to escape the madness of the house. So unless one of us needs to be home alone, for example, right now Fantasia, she’s probably taking our three year old with her to the store actually right now. But we definitely don’t have a general rule on taking my kid with me, but we do go over our groceries in the house when we come home with them, they’re in the kitchen with us taking stuff out and putting it away.

Ben Grynol (08:32):

Yeah, we’ve got a little farmer’s market, that’s where we get go to every Saturday they go, they help to pick out all the produce. That’s where we basically get our produce and meat and that’s all, they don’t really carry packaged goods, it’s just that. So that becomes really easy. But where it’s hard is you can get the grocery store meltdown where or… They aren’t terrible, but sometimes they’re like, “I really want that thing.” It’s easier, as terrible as it is to say, it’s easier to just throw that thing in the cart and get on with it. And it doesn’t mean that you’re leaning into giving them everything they want, but sometimes the easier thing. And it’s so easy from an outside perspective to be like, “Well I wouldn’t do that. Now I would be a lot more firm.” And it’s when you’re in that situation and maybe you’re on a tight timeline, you got to get to the next place you’re going, the kid is upset, you’re just like, “Put the thing in the car, let’s go.” So what have you done around that? You have strategies you use?

Austin McGuffie (09:36):

Man, I give in probably just the majority of people, I try to, so I do my best to prioritize protein. I know that’s one of those sayings, prioritize protein, but actually it’s really important in our home. So perfect example, I had a call with you, Mike and Tony maybe a month ago, and we were just talking about content. Fantasia was not feeling well, so I’m the go-to dad and Carter, our three year old, he’s really hungry and he’s asking for a granola bar and a piece of candy. We have a stash of candy and he’s like, you know, you can imagine you’re getting ready for a call. I’m trying to gather all my things and move around and I’ve got a three year old in my ear and I have so much bandwidth for things I can give him my attention to, and unfortunately he wasn’t high on the list at the time.

(10:27):

So in that moment it’s like, shoot man, here’s exactly what you’re asking for, so that I can be quiet. Normally we have, I don’t know, beef sticks or something on hand to give them before we give into what they want, but in this situation, man, it was just like, “Here dude, just take this and you’ll be okay. I hope you’ll be okay.”

Ben Grynol (10:49):

Yeah. The hard thing is kids become accustomed to that where they start to go, I know the game. Especially kids are so much smarter than we will think they are at times where they’re like, “I see Dad isn’t on a call right now. I know.” They connect the dots, “I know that means that he’s probably going to say no, I don’t have time.” So they know they can get their way and that’s where it gets really hard is you can do your best to not have the packaged goods in the house and you can do your best with things, but the reality is things happen. Our neighbor, great example, lovely lady, she’s 86 years old and she comes over with buckets of Halloween candy or Christmas stuff all the time. And so you’re sitting there going… What do you do? They know they want that thing that they just saw. And so then you have to balance all that.

Austin McGuffie (11:45):

Yeah, I think that firm no goes a long way, sometimes, but I can’t even say as Metabolism Mentor, as the dad who preaches about kids’ nutrition, man, I got a bucket full of Halloween candy in my closet right now that the kids know is there. And every day when they get home from school it’s like, “Hey, can I have a piece of candy?” And again, when you have all the things going on, and I think that’s what’s so tough about taking care of kids, taking care of them number one, but then feeding them well, number two is that, Ben, you and I are busy too. We’re still trying to handle all the things that we have going on and it’s really hard to slow down to basically prioritize and make conscious decisions about what we’re putting in their bodies. So I have moments where I cave, but I think that you have to give yourself grace for that, if the other 80% of the time when you’re not caving, you’re feeding your kids good food.

(12:44):

I think that the human species naturally we’re risk takers to some degree. I was listening to a podcast, with Casey and Dr. [inaudible 00:12:52] are talking about uric acid and he was saying that primitively humans, we become more risk takers when we’re seeking food, nourishing our bodies. And I think that a lot of us as parents especially, we’re like, “How much junk can my kids have without jeopardizing their health?” That’s a balance. It’s tough, because if I give my kid a Snickers, what are the chances that he’s going to accumulate a bunch of fructose in his liver and have fatty liver from one Snicker a week? Chances are not very likely. So that makes that decision a little bit easier for me. So it’s a constant, what can I get away with with my kids, while still making sure that they’re healthy. And that looks different for everybody.

Ben Grynol (13:49):

Yeah. That one’s really interesting and it’s hard too because you don’t want to give in all the time. You want to make sure that they’re experiencing the world in a way that feels positive, feels somewhat neutral, somewhat relatable maybe to their peers. Because you don’t want to be the hippie kid that it’s like, oh yeah, that’s your dad’s just a health nut. Right? Because-

Austin McGuffie (14:15):

I’m definitely that dad.

Ben Grynol (14:15):

… you become known as that.

Austin McGuffie (14:19):

Yeah, and it sucks.

Ben Grynol (14:23):

But I mean it’s all done with positive intent. But sometimes, last night was a great example, where you can see as soon as you start to see patterns and you see them clearly, our two girls, Penelope and Zoe really wanted to have ice cream and it was a little bit later, not 10:00 PM late, but it was maybe, whatever six, already seven, so they might have had the ice cream around then and they go to bed shortly after and they just both wake up like terrors, because they probably had a terrible sleep and they just had a pile of sugar before bed. And these are things, but you’re pushing back against it, you’re saying, “No, you can’t have this. Here’s why.” And there’s the point where you’re like, “Okay, you’re going to wake up your brother. Stop.” Right? So then you feel it is like you’re caught in between these two worlds and it’s just a very real parenting thing.

Austin McGuffie (15:21):

I think that, so it’s funny, we had a similar experience. This was our framework around Halloween and we’re usually very strict and we are definitely those parents where people they look at us before they hand our kids snacks, like, “Oh shoot, am I going to get in trouble for this?” But for Halloween we took the approach, let’s moderate their candy intake. So they went around the neighborhood and each of them came home with, I mean the amount of candy that they have access to is absolutely, it’s ridiculous, and then they expected for us to let them keep the candy in their closets, which was obviously not happening.

(15:54):

But what we did was we went to each of their rooms and we said, “Hey, pick your favorite 10 pieces of candy and I want you to put that away in a secret place, and I’m going to let you moderate that throughout the week. I’m going to suggest having one piece of candy a week, but let me see how you do on your own.”

(16:10):

Two of the kids, my girls, Cadence and Caitlin, smashed it, right? Actually Cadence still has some more, but they both, they didn’t moderate how we taught them to, which is fine, they’re five and seven years old, but they both ended up getting sick just a couple days later. Our seven year old who’s very perceptive, she had stomach aches, her mood was just completely off for a few days, and it was a really good opportunity for Fantasia and I to sit down with them and be like, “Look, this is why we say no.” And so I think kids are very smart. I think if we actually sit down and explain the no to them, even though they fight us on it, they understand, and I’m okay with that.

(16:53):

That’s a victory for me. Even if you’re still fighting me on it, I could look at my seven year old in her eyes and it’s a small smile at the corner of her mouth and that lets me know that she gets it. But it’s like, “Look girl, you feel terrible. You’re yelling at me right now about how hungry you are, so your blood sugar’s probably all over the place and this is a really good opportunity for you to understand why I tell you no about eating candy all the time.”

(17:19):

So I think allowing the room for your kids to experience that is important. It’s just like adults experiencing failure. How are we going to learn and grow if we’re not constantly trying and failing things? And I look at kids’ nutrition the same way. If you’re not eating poor food and understanding the ramifications of it, then you’re not going to understand why I say no. So yeah, it was a really good learning opportunity for them and for us.

Ben Grynol (17:46):

Not giving a kid things like Gatorade every day, Gatorade period, but just there are very real situations where you see it and it’s actually super sad when you see kids just crushing 500 milliliter bottles of Coke and you’re like, “Man, you’re three you shouldn’t.” No one should be drinking that-

Austin McGuffie (18:05):

Right.

Ben Grynol (18:05):

But-

Austin McGuffie (18:07):

A three year old.

Ben Grynol (18:07):

A three year old Gatorade, and sometimes parents do it because they think Gatorade is nourishing or just marketing gone wrong. So you shouldn’t be doing that obviously, but where it gets hard is there’s going to be the mac and cheese that the kid wants and that’s just real. And there’s going to be the processed things and where it gets harder, at least what we find is harder, is kids go to school, they’re around a friend group and they come home with a lot of outside influence, or they watch videos, they see something on YouTube that is some show, the Stella Show, whatever show it is the kids are watching, and then they want that [inaudible 00:18:48]. And that’s super hard. That feels like an uphill battle all the time.

Austin McGuffie (18:52):

It is an uphill battle, man. Yeah, it’s really tough. But I think that’s, again, it’s a part of the learning experience in a sense. And those are good, it’s just really important to talk to the kids as if they’re adults in a sense, where it’s like, “Hey look.” Something that my parents told me all the time when I was growing up, anytime I was like, “Well mom, such and such had this.” And she was like, “Well that’s not my kid.” And it’s a good opportunity for me to not say it in the same way, but it’s like look, “We have a set of standards that we live by in this house and there’s a reason for that, and these are the list of reasons why.” So our nine year old, Camden, he’s at the age now where he’s starting to understand. So he comes home from trick or treating and he’s got this bag full of candy and he didn’t even ask to keep it.

(19:44):

The other ones did. He said, “Hey dad, here I know you’re going to take it anyway, but here I already had some candy earlier so I don’t need this anymore.” And that’s after nine years of having these adult-like conversations with him about how important it is for him to not only not do what everyone else is doing, but to understand how the stuff is affecting your body. And everything that you see out there in the world, which is really tough to have these conversations with kids, because you want them to be sensitive to other people’s struggles. But it’s like, “Hey look buddy, this is the rate of people that are sick from food.” So you start talking about kids with fatty liver disease, which is increasing, and then you start talking about pre-diabetes statistics and just all the downstream complications of the food that most people are eating in this country. And it’s like, “Hey, you don’t want that.” And they understand that they don’t want it either. So.

Ben Grynol (20:43):

What do you do for talking through physical activity? How do you position it to them? Because there’s so many things that kids… I mean your kids run around outside all the time, that’s physical activity. They don’t need to be doing jumping jacks to be exercising, but how do you talk about the importance of that?

Austin McGuffie (21:01):

Well, it’s interesting because a few years ago we lived in a neighborhood where there were not any kids, so there were no kids in the neighborhood, and so it was really tough to break down the importance of exercise to kids because I’m not sure how well structured exercise programs work for kids whose brains aren’t fully developed. They’re just supposed to be outside playing and having fun. So now, fortunately, we prioritized moving to a place where there were a lot of kids and that the culture of the neighborhood is go outside and play. But even when the kids do have, especially our girls, I don’t know our nine year old we rarely see him. He’s being raised by the streets right now. But our two girls, they love to be inside and sometimes it’s just we just ask them, “Hey, have you moved your body? How do you feel, you feel tired? You’re feeling lazy> Well there’s a reason for that.”

(21:58):

And it’s not so much me telling them to do it, it’s, “Come with me, let’s go outside together.” And I’ll get a football soccer ball, ask them to show me some of their favorite gymnastics moves. And it becomes less me telling them how important it’s to move and me showing them like, “Hey, come with me so that you can see why this is important to me, and then you do it too.” And that makes it a little bit more fun than preachy.

Ben Grynol (22:26):

When you start leaning into what they’re interested in, then it becomes less of a forcing function where they’re like, “Oh, I don’t want to do that thing.” If a kid doesn’t want to play football, kid doesn’t want to go on their bike, that’s not of interest then finding the other things, and I say it because, so our eldest is eight and he’s super into dancing. He loves dancing, he loves ballet, he loves all these things and he practices, he’s just taught himself by watching The Wiggles and he watches all these videos, but that’s physical, we talk to him about how great that physical movement is for his body. And he’ll do it for hours, but he’s not super interested in going outside to play soccer or something. It’s just not of interest. And so it’s leaning into those things and saying it’s totally cool to do that.

(23:17):

Now it’s the caveat is balancing the whole idea of screen time with you’re doing something that’s physically active, there’s screen time involved, whole different conversation. But it’s important to be outside, but it’s more important to be moving period, to be doing things that are good for your body, as opposed to just being sedentary. And so as long as they understand that he calls it dancing now, or he says music, he’s like, “Hey, can I have some music time?” And you’re like, “Yeah man, for sure.” And he’ll literally just put on Spotify and that’s fine. But he’s doing that and that’s a thing that’s separate from everything else. And so we never want it to be one of those things if you’re not outside, if you’re not wanting to play hockey or you’re not wanting to do whatever, that’s fine.

Austin McGuffie (24:06):

Right?

Ben Grynol (24:07):

Because then they wouldn’t it and they feel disengaged.

Austin McGuffie (24:10):

Exactly. If you really think about what is happening inside of the body when you move your body, we understand that muscles… Well first of all, building muscle and having muscle is really important. And then when you understand that how muscles interact with glucose in the blood and how all of that helps to create a more metabolically healthy environment in your body, then you can look at different types of activity differently, instead of just thinking about structured exercise or playing sports. But shoot, my wife and I, we run a physical education program for our kids’ school, and so when we first started two years ago… This is a self-directed learning academy, so these kids are pretty much navigating their way through their curriculum, being guided of course by adults, but for the most part it’s their responsibility. When we first started doing the exercises with them, I went there and I had my whistle, I had a workout plan, hey, pushups, squats, lunges, all these things.

(25:09):

And the kids were excited about it at first, but after a few weeks, just like adults, we lost their attention a little bit. Some of them stuck around, because they were actually interested in doing it. But the ones that had no interest, they didn’t participate and because they didn’t participate, they weren’t exercising. And so after a year and a half of doing that, I took a step back and I was like, “Man, how can we get everybody to be active without… And keep their morale high?” And the answer was spend time with them individually to figure out what type of movement works for them.

(25:42):

So now instead of PE being everybody doing the same thing, I’ve got some kids over here doing some resistance training, because they enjoy it. I’ve got kids over here doing dancing, some over here doing cheer. I’ve got a few over here doing parkour and it’s all accomplishing the same goal. It just looks different for everybody. So like you said, man, very important, leaning into a type of activity that encourages them to just move their body, whatever it is. I think that’s just the name of the game, is finding interest in what they’re interested in.

Ben Grynol (26:15):

As soon as it becomes like a game where they feel they’re participating in something, and it doesn’t mean that there’s some game with some outcome, riding a bike it’s not necessarily a game, but it feels like something that’s fluid and that kids can enjoy. Very different than, “Be here at this time to do this thing.” And the same principal goes with eating, “Sit here, eat this thing because I told you so.”

(26:43):

When that’s the case, when you start to push these fundamentals or this foundation on kids, it’s natural that they would push back. The same reason I think that education is so broken in so many ways because it’s like, “Hey, when was the Spanish Armada?” And some kid’s like, “Man, I don’t know.” And it’s like, “You get an F.” But the kid could be unbelievable at understanding physics or something, right? But physics, let’s assume physics isn’t part of the curriculum, and so this kid is sitting there going like, “What?” It’s the same thing of if a kid feels that they are being told to do exercise in a certain way or to eat things because you say it’s like they might… A great example’s a kid might love broccoli and hate Brussel sprouts and if you keep trying to push the Brussel sprouts and they’re just like, “I don’t want it.” And then all they want is the candy. And you were literally one degree away from having that healthy lock in.

Austin McGuffie (27:40):

That’s me, dude. I had that experience with my seven year old. I would make, she likes broccoli and kale and sometimes green beans, anything other than that, she just refuses. So now I get in the kitchen and I’m not mindful of her dietary preferences all the time, I’m trying to cook for five other people in the house, but I’ll throw on some carrots for example, roasted carrots and she’s like, “Dad.” And she’s throwing a fit, “I’m not going to eat that.” And then naturally as a parent, when your kid tells you what they’re not going to do, it’s like, oh hold on. That’s not how this is supposed to work. So then it’s you try hard for this not to happen, but it becomes an ego thing where it’s like, “Well no, you’re going to eat this because this is the food that I made and you’re going to eat what’s on my plate.”

(28:26):

You know what I’m saying? And it’s a total fail, because she clearly said, she said, “I’m not going to eat that because you already know I like spinach, broccoli, kale, or whatever it is, and I don’t like carrots.” And my ego is like, “No, you’re going to eat these carrots because I’m your dad, and I cooked it.” And then the non egotistical side of me is like, “Bro, why can’t I just make sure I have broccoli and kale in the fridge at all times to feed her?” So yeah, I had to learn it the hard way.

Ben Grynol (28:58):

It always feels like parenting is one of those things that no matter what you do, it feels like a failure because your kid smacks his head, gets stitches, you feel the failure, right?

Austin McGuffie (29:11):

Yep.

Ben Grynol (29:11):

Kid is on a good path for eating and then they start having maybe outside influence or they’re pushing back on certain things, it feels like failure. The kid’s maybe having challenges in school, feel like a failure. And so it’s one of those things where to raise balance, maybe that’s the word, balanced kids that have this foundation for physical activity, health and wellness, and understand this at a very basic level so that it doesn’t feel like… You never want the kid to be like, “Well I don’t eat the croissant because my dad says no.” You don’t want that, because then they’ve got this unhealthy relationship with food in general.

(29:47):

Where it’s like, “No, no, time and a place you’re going to do it. Just understand what’s going to happen. Doesn’t mean it’s all the time thing. It might be a sometime, it’s a treat thing. We’re not doing cupcakes every day, we’re not doing whatever it is every day. But now and again we’re going to live a balanced life.” And to raise kids across the gamut of education and physical activity, food, just general health and wellness, it’s very hard. So it always feels like you’re behind in doing it, coming to terms that it’s not an easy thing, it’s just back to the beginning. It’s parenting is real.

Austin McGuffie (30:27):

It is hard, bro. And that’s why it always feels like failure. Because imagine, have you ever tried to ride a hoverboard? Don’t do it, they’re awful. Not for adults, but I was trying to ride a hoverboard and you have to have really good balance. And I’m not sure why kids do it so well, maybe their center of gravity is lower, but man, I got on this hoverboard and I’m trying to balance myself, but when you balance yourself you continuously over-correct. And that’s what it’s like having kids and trying to balance. It’s like I see myself going forward and I’m like, oh, let me lean back and I’m going too far back. And I’m like, well no, let me lean forward. And so it’s a constant tug of war and I think that especially with nutrition with the kids, it’s when I see my kids and they’ve had… And it’s so hard to avoid, bro. If you’ve got birthday party after birthday party after birthday party at school and I’m not there, you’re coming home eating cupcakes and then you’re continuously craving sugar, I’m going to aggressively push in the opposite direction.

(31:27):

And now it’s no sugar and eat these vegetables, and now I’m juicing every day. And we go from one extreme to the next, trying to find a state of homeostasis. And it’s really tough because you have constant, just consistent things that are influencing the outcome and the direction that things are going. And that’s why it’s easy to feel a failure. Education, nutrition, shoot, man, marriage.

Ben Grynol (31:56):

All of it. It’s all a package. It is a package. So what do you have as far as takeaways or advice that any parents who have kids that might not be open to trying new things or, at one time, I ask, because Penelope’s a great example. She’s six, she was super good about eating chicken and Brussel sprouts and just having a good foundation of eating whole food, and now she’s very much on the, “I want chicken fingers, I want mac and cheese train.” And then you get all this outside influence that you’re like, “Oh, this is a lot harder to get off of.” “I want McDonald’s, I want Domino’s.” And you’re like, “No, no, we’re not doing that. We’re not doing that. Maybe once in a while but we’re not doing that.” And then it becomes, they ask every day and you’re like, “Where did this come from?” So what advice do you have for parents who have kids that might not be open to trying new foods, or what would be your approach for reestablishing some of these food introductions? Is it that asking your daughter, what is it that you do like?

Austin McGuffie (33:04):

Yeah, I think that’s where it starts. I think that I’ve heard one of my friends say that 90% of parenting is marketing. It’s all about how you present it. And so I think if I… Two completely different scenarios, well the same scenario two different times, I’m trying to get my three year old to eat these roasted carrots and the first time it’s 7:30, so it’s already late. I’m low on patience and I’ve got a whole bunch of other stuff in my mind. So it’s like, “Right, eat those carrots right now or else.” I don’t know, “I’m going to take your toy or something.” And that’s my lower self I guess responding to it. But then on the flip side of that, when it’s six o’clock and I have so much more patience and I really want him to eat it, I sit down right next to him and first of all we get in the kitchen together, so I let him help me season the carrots.

(34:02):

It’s like, “You sprinkle the salt, you sprinkle the pepper, these are your carrots, you’re going to take ownership of this. This is your dish for the evening.” And then when we sit down, I take the first bite and I’m like, “Man, Carter, you did a good job. You put your foot in these carrots, bro. This is just delicious.” And then it’s like a, it tricks them and then he’s like, “You know what? I did put my foot in these carrots, this tastes good.” And it’s like man, it’s been like that with every single one of our kids. And I have to credit my wife Fantasia for that because she made it a point early on, not even really knowing what she was doing for real, maybe she did, but she had each of our kids in the kitchen with her from the moment they were two, three years old.

(34:45):

And every single time our kids come in the kitchen and make something for themselves, they love it. It could be the most disgusting stuff. Our nine year old has come in the kitchen and he makes these concoctions of just things you wouldn’t imagine, things you wouldn’t try. And it’s like, “Hey dad, you want to try this?” And I’m like, “Dude, that looks disgusting, no.” But he’s devouring it, not because it actually tastes good, but because there’s a sense of ownership in what he ate and what he created. So I think probably the number one thing I would say is give your kids ownership. Write it on a piece of paper, “Carter, you’re in charge of the carrots, Cadence, you’re in charge of the rice.” Or whatever the case is. And they’ll tear it up, man, tear it up.

Ben Grynol (35:32):

That’s behavioral economics, [inaudible 00:35:37] the Ikea effect, where it’s like you overvalue everything that you make or you put effort into making. So that’s why, how much did you pay for that Ikea desk? It was a hundred bucks. You go to sell it, well that thing’s worth $200 for sure, because you made it right. But it happens when kids cook, if you get kids cooking, they start to learn about the food, they learn about how it all comes together from an ingredient standpoint. And even if things are relatively simple, making eggs, doesn’t matter what it is, they understand this and then they feel that they’ve contributed to doing this. Even cutting the avocado, they own that. Right?

Austin McGuffie (36:13):

Exactly.

Ben Grynol (36:14):

They help to do that. And so they feel more inclined to eat those foods. And I think that’s the important thing is you can put some kids in a classroom and you can put up all these posters and help them learn about this is broccoli and broccoli’s good for you, or you can just get them to make the damned broccoli and they’re probably going to learn a lot more.

Austin McGuffie (36:36):

Exactly.

Ben Grynol (36:37):

How it cooks. How to cook it.

Austin McGuffie (36:38):

And then come on the back end, some kids are not really, they haven’t had the neural pathways connected to truly understand the impact of eating certain foods on their body. They’re just not capable of understanding. So you got to get on their level and give them something they can’t understand. Like, “Hey, even if you don’t understand why you should be eating broccoli, if you just make this, if you get involved in the process.” We do this with the kids at the school, it’s some of them vehemently oppose vegetables, “I don’t eat vegetables.” But we’ll come with some spinach and some celery and a whole bunch of other stuff and everybody puts gloves on and it’s like, “We’re just going to juice this. Okay, we’re going to make some juice. We’ve got some apples and some ginger to spice it up a little bit.” But they get involved in making it and they drink it and they don’t always like it, but they’ll at least try it and expose themselves to it, because they were involved in the process. So absolutely man, get these kids in the kitchen and let them create stuff.

Ben Grynol (37:38):

Yeah. Because we’ve got these irrational biases towards what a food means, so I think anecdotally kids grow up and they’re like, “Ooh, spinach.” Meanwhile, they’ve never tried it. They don’t know. You hear the anecdote of, “Oh spinach, that’s the healthy thing. That’s gross.” Whatever vegetable it might be. And so as soon as you can get them to like it, you make cream spinach or something, that’s a lot different than just eating a handful of raw spinach. Right?

Austin McGuffie (38:04):

Right.

Ben Grynol (38:05):

Very, very different. And so it’s like you make the spinach taste like the mac and cheese. A lot different.

Austin McGuffie (38:12):

Seriously, that’s a really big hack. I was making vegetables all the time and it took me having a conversation with my seven year old, her emotional intelligence is just up there, so she’s teaching me about myself all the time, but she’s eating this food and she’s like, “It just doesn’t taste good.” And I’m thinking that you don’t like vegetables. But no, it really doesn’t taste good. Cook good food, do your best to make your food taste good. That’s something that I never really… I don’t know why I’m a whole grown man and I didn’t know how to make broccoli tastes good. I grew up eating steamed broccoli. That’s what my parents made for us, and that’s the only way I knew to make it. And so I was putting a boiling pot of water and steaming broccoli over it and then putting a little bit of salt on it and saying, “Here.” But then it’s all chewy and it’s not easy it’s not… You know what I’m saying?

(39:01):

And it just wasn’t palatable for them. So earlier on I was like, “Oh, my kids don’t broccoli.” I was like, “No bro, you just suck at cooking.” Throw some olive oil on it, some salt, pepper, some garlic powder and throw it in the oven and roast it instead. And then it tastes completely different. Same nutrients, maybe not as bioavailable since we cooked it to whatever, but it exposes them to broccoli and it’s oh, it’s not that they don’t like broccoli, it’s just that my dad sucked at cooking.

Ben Grynol (39:31):

Yeah, it’s the same with chips too, where it’s chips are this thing that kids might want. I don’t know if they actually want the potato chip though, what they want is something crunchy and salty and small that they put in their mouth. So you turn that into kale chips with Parmesan on top of it, or a Brussel sprout, peel the leaves, little salt, little olive oil. You make those into chips pretty quickly, they’re still in their eyes, they’re still chips.

Austin McGuffie (39:55):

Exactly.

Ben Grynol (39:56):

They’re still getting the crunch and the salt and it’s a lot different than just crushing the deep fried potatoes.

Austin McGuffie (40:03):

Exactly.

Ben Grynol (40:04):

Those are not doing anyone any favors.

Austin McGuffie (40:07):

And it’s the same thing goes for sweet stuff. And you can have, instead of the kids eating candy, they’ll come in the kitchen on their own, they’ll cut up an apple, they’ll throw it in a skillet and we have a small jar of maple syrup and I’ll let them use it, “Hey, just throw some maple syrup on some apples and some cinnamon.” And they’ll leave that instead of going to find a pack of Skittles or something like that. So finding nutritious ways for your kids to have that same psychological effect. You want something sweet, you want something salty, you want something crunchy, that’s fine. I’m just going to take five extra minutes to think about how to give that to you without compromising your health. And I don’t know all the different hacks, but I’m sure if we sat here and listed them out, we could probably come up with 150 different ways to help our kids cure their sweet tooth without them actually having something loaded with high fructose corn syrup.

Ben Grynol (41:03):

I love that. 150 ways to cure-

Austin McGuffie (41:06):

Hey there we go.

Ben Grynol (41:07):

150 hacks for kids. There you go. That’s the next project together.

Austin McGuffie (41:12):

Got you. That’s it. We can crank that out. That’s cool. I have a question for you. Ben.

Ben Grynol (41:16):

Yeah, man.

Austin McGuffie (41:17):

So you have four kids and you are the head of growth for this very cool tech company that lets people see how food affects their health. So you’re constantly exposed to all this data about all the things, how do you, especially with your kids, pizza for example, how do you reconcile in your mind letting your kids enjoy these things, knowing that you’re trying to solve the metabolic health crisis?

Ben Grynol (41:47):

Interesting question. So it’s not a battle that you can win with all of them, but with some of them sequencing. So one of the kids too young to do anything, because he’s one, but the other ones, one, three, six, eight, so the three year old and the eight year old really like salad. And so you sequence it, “Here you go, here’s your Caesar salad.” Make it fresh, it’s good to go. Or some other type of salad. And they’ll eat that before they eat the pizza. And they’re not crushing nine slices of pizza, they might have two slices of pizza, and they’ll enjoy it. And so not creating fear around that.

(42:29):

Sometimes when we make it at home, that’s if we pick up or something like that, but if we make it at home, then we’ll make it on these, we’ve got these flat breads that are, they’re basically zero net carbs, because they’re full of fiber and they’re pretty thin and stuff and they eat that and they don’t really know. You just have to hack your way into it. And so that is a lot different than doing the, here’s the Domino’s over and over.

(42:58):

Don’t get me wrong. We do the Domino’s from time to time because they’re kids because that’s what they want. I’m not saying that I’m a huge fan of doing it, but it’s a matter of balancing it. And it’s like if you’re going to have this, then we’re going to have salad, or whatever it is with it and work your way towards it. I think that’s the key, is working the way towards it. Because it’s not a one and done, okay, you can’t win every meal. You can’t. But you can over time create the foundation, so they’re opting into their own choices. They make the choices themselves whether or not they want to eat that. Kind of like what you said, where it’s like as long as they understand the reason they feel bad, then they start to avoid those foods on their own. They’re like, “I’m not going to eat that thing because it doesn’t make me feel super good.”

Austin McGuffie (43:47):

Yeah, that’s interesting. Sequencing. We try that. Well, we do that with our kids now with protein mostly, none of our kids like salad. We haven’t gotten to that level of parenting yet. But that’s interesting because a lot of parents, man, I get questions all the time, how do I feed my kids healthy food? And despite the exposure that I have to all this and the knowledge and all these things, it’s a hard question to answer every single time because everybody’s kids are so different. Your situation is different. And the environment that we all live in is just, like you said, man, it’s an uphill battle. Last night for example, we were in at the hospital, a three year old gash on his head and we didn’t eat dinner. It’s like, bro, there’s a Arby’s right across the street. And it’s like, what do we do? Am I going to wait and starve my kids until we get home, because I want to avoid this fast food option?

(44:45):

No, I’m not going to do that, man. So we’re going to eat these processed roast beef mini sandwiches and you guys are going to be fed, and we’re going to wake up in the morning and we’re going to try again tomorrow. And that’s just the environment that we live in. So it’s hard to exist in the world, but not conform to the ways of the world, which is a twist on spiritual concept. But for nutrition that’s something that we all have to task ourselves to do is to exist in the world which is pursuing balance, but not succumbing to the ways of the world where we’re constantly exposing ourselves to these things all the time and ushering our kids to a life of all the things that come with poor nutrition.

Ben Grynol (45:32):

Yeah. Yeah. It ties into traveling too. Traveling as an adult you can make the decision, so let’s say you’re traveling, whether you’re road tripping it or hitting an airplane, it’s the choices are relatively the same. Relatively, right. It’s a lot easier as an adult because you can just decide to, “Oh, I’m going to fast, I’m going to… I’ll eat when I eat, I’ll grab at the…” At an airport, let’s say you’ll grab raw cashews or something, or raw almonds, things that are still whole food, fall within your food philosophy easy enough. It’s pretty hard with kids. It’s super hard, right?

(46:15):

Because it’s you pull over, there’s the gas station and some Arby’s or some Subway or whatever it is, and you’re like, “This is all there is around here.” I guess you got to do it, right? You’re on a road trip or you’re in an airport, and it’s just fast food, fast food, fast food. What do you do? You can’t. Right?

Austin McGuffie (46:34):

I mean, food has to be… We all have a relationship with food and as much as I wish I could, if I had the affinity stones and I could snap my fingers, I wouldn’t get rid of half the population, but I would take taste away. I would take taste away, so that everybody can just eat. There’s just all the food, the only reason you’ll eat food is food that benefits you. There’s no more bad food because it doesn’t taste like anything. But like you said, raw almonds. How am I going to get my five year old to eat raw almonds? It tastes like cardboard or it’s just nuts. There’s nothing to it. But food it just has to be palatable for kids to enjoy it. And it takes a lot of energy to be planning for, when you’re taking a road trip, a trip out of the state, or if you’re just going on a 30 minute drive. It just takes energy to think about, what am I going to feed my kids if they get hungry?

(47:30):

And if you catch yourself out here in these streets and you don’t have any food on hand, you just set yourself up for failure. And you can’t blame yourself, or you can for not preparing, but beyond that, you become a victim to your environment. And I think that’s ultimately what is happening in this country and with our kids. It’s not anybody’s fault. Nobody’s purposefully poisoning children. Well, maybe some food companies are, but individually we’re not purposefully poisoning our children. We’re just doing the best we can to feed them, and that oftentimes comes with those low quality food choices.